Another gutless performance

[BendJack]

In all fairness the Foxes were a different class and Jordan James oozed class and maturity beyond his young age.

I thought we would have been "up for this" as a win would have propelled us into the playoffs.

Unfortunately, another bad case of stage fright or sitting their pants, with tactics reverting to backwards football instead of hoofing it route 1 into the swirling wind.

We tried the impossible today by trying to outplay Leicester at the beautiful game.

If the Swans took their chances in the same way by shooting from distance instead of trying to fight their way into the goal, the results may indeed have been different...

It seems ANY criticism ATM is viewed, by some, as an overreaction or "entitlement" instead of constructive suggestions to improve! It's completely disingenuous to claim everything is great at Swansea City when the team clearly have an inability to consistently take their chances -- instead putting to hold the all, pass backwards or sideways and completely slow down virtually all momentum.

I believe the team we have are doing themselves a huge disservice as they're better than this! It's not "entitlement" to want to see the players play to the potential we know they have - especially when we've seen these glimpses and capabilities in the past, even from Josh Key at range!

 

[JackFish]

Praise the Lord someone talking sense. If we lose to Southampton, this place will be toxic. As I said on other posts. First time in 15 years we have a player who had gone on a consistent goal scoring record in VP. Beat record in 5 years for home record. And statistically the most hardest set of first set of matches in the championship, oh and we just beat a Premier league team. We need to improve 100%. But overreaction is mad.

What do you mean the hardest first set of matches? Compared to who? We’ve played four top half teams and five bottom half, including the teams in 21st, 23rd & 24th.

I also have no idea what you mean about consistent goalscorers? Were Piroe, McBurnie & Bony not then?

 

[Swansea93]

Really? I don’t think that his caretaker days brought about a different approach to the game. Whilst the results were good, it was hardly fast free flowing football (a phrase someone once coined on here).

Agree it wasn’t free flowing but I do think it was a bit more progressive and entertaining, think it’s a bit safe now.

 

[monmouth]

What do you mean the hardest first set of matches? Compared to who? We’ve played four top half teams and five bottom half, including the teams in 21st, 23rd & 24th.

I also have no idea what you mean about consistent goalscorers? Were Piroe, McBurnie & Bony not then?

15 years includes Michu too. If it’s 5, as you say, is anyone seriously comparing Vipotnik with Piroe?

I don’t know why there’s a need for people (not you JF) to dress what we’re seeing up as brilliant, or garbage tbh. If I had to come up with two words to describe it, it would be ‘needs improvement’. One word, would probably, if I were pushed, be ‘meh’.

It’s time to put this ‘hardest opening’ to bed too. As you say, one of the few actual facts available is we’ve played three of the bottom 4 and they are the teams that we have beaten. That is simply a fact.

 

[JackSomething]

All this about taking long-range shots and players not taking opportunities to shoot bears little resemblance to what I saw on the pitch in front of me yesterday.

The first two chances of the game fell to us, with Eom shooting from just inside the box and Ronald from just outside (from memory, so I may be getting where they took the shoots from wrong). Both were weak efforts straight at the goalkeeper. Same with an effort later in the first half from Cullen. Some of the times the fans were moaning about players not shooting were when a player had an opponent right in front of them who would have blocked the shot, or they were off balance and a shot would have probably ended up in row z.

It's not as if they made the right decision every time, but the suggestion here that we are passing up golden shooting opportunities to make another pass is just factually incorrect. Not to mention shots from farther out are far less likely to result in goals. Leicester certainly weren't giving Vipotnik ten yards of space to set himself like Plymouth did.

We started yesterday well, then they scored a beauty and controlled the rest of the half. We started the second half with much more intent and worked hard closing down, winning the ball back in their half multiple times. I don't know how we didn't score from the shot inside the area where the keeper stuck his hand out and got lucky (I think it was Vipotnik after Ronald got in behind the defence and crossed it) and then we equalised. After that, Leicester went up a gear and we couldn't live with them.

There are definitely issues that need sorting. Key and Ronald have zero understanding after so long playing together it's crazy. Playing Cullen instead of a third CM to try and create more through the middle didn't work. Franco, Stamenic, Cullen and Vipotnik hardly touched the ball.

We look like a team that's going to finish mid-table with the hope we'll improve as the season goes on. If half the fans are happy enough with Sheehan and half not, that's probably about right.

 

[Pegojack]

All this about taking long-range shots and players not taking opportunities to shoot bears little resemblance to what I saw on the pitch in front of me yesterday.

The first two chances of the game fell to us, with Eom shooting from just inside the box and Ronald from just outside (from memory, so I may be getting where they took the shoots from wrong). Both were weak efforts straight at the goalkeeper. Same with an effort later in the first half from Cullen. Some of the times the fans were moaning about players not shooting were when a player had an opponent right in front of them who would have blocked the shot, or they were off balance and a shot would have probably ended up in row z.

It's not as if they made the right decision every time, but the suggestion here that we are passing up golden shooting opportunities to make another pass is just factually incorrect. Not to mention shots from farther out are far less likely to result in goals. Leicester certainly weren't giving Vipotnik ten yards of space to set himself like Plymouth did.

We started yesterday well, then they scored a beauty and controlled the rest of the half. We started the second half with much more intent and worked hard closing down, winning the ball back in their half multiple times. I don't know how we didn't score from the shot inside the area where the keeper stuck his hand out and got lucky (I think it was Vipotnik after Ronald got in behind the defence and crossed it) and then we equalised. After that, Leicester went up a gear and we couldn't live with them.

There are definitely issues that need sorting. Key and Ronald have zero understanding after so long playing together it's crazy. Playing Cullen instead of a third CM to try and create more through the middle didn't work. Franco, Stamenic, Cullen and Vipotnik hardly touched the ball.

We look like a team that's going to finish mid-table with the hope we'll improve as the season goes on. If half the fans are happy enough with Sheehan and half not, that's probably about right.

I wasn't able to watch the match so can't comment on the action. I did say when the teams had been announced that I didn't like our line up and felt we'd be weak in midfield against possibly the best team in the Championship. Looks like that's how it turned out.
The point I'd like to make is that I don't believe in rotation and 'resting' players. If a professional player can't play two games four days apart, there's something wrong. I think we should always put out our best starting eleven. If people are flagging after 50/60 minutes, that's what subs are for.
This is what I think is our best 11 and these should have started:
Vig
Key Burgess Cabango Tymon
Franco Yalcoure Galbraith
Inoussa Vipotnik Ronald

No strong criticism intended, we can't win every game. But I feel we'd have had a better chance with that line up.

 

[monmouth]

I wasn't able to watch the match so can't comment on the action. I did say when the teams had been announced that I didn't like our line up and felt we'd be weak in midfield against possibly the best team in the Championship. Looks like that's how it turned out.
The point I'd like to make is that I don't believe in rotation and 'resting' players. If a professional player can't play two games four days apart, there's something wrong. I think we should always put out our best starting eleven. If people are flagging after 50/60 minutes, that's what subs are for.

100% this for me Pegs. I don’t think we have any idea of what actually is our best team yet, but if starters are changed every match, it’ll never ‘jelly’.

 

[Frankie Burrows Cap]

I’m not one to moan when the ball goes back at times as I don’t mind patient build up play but when you’re literally in the opposition box, the ball should never be leaving there unless cleared by a defender. You can’t beat the press and then unbeat it.

My biggest bug bear. If you want to play out from the back that’s fine, but the whole point is surely to beat that first press and take a minimum of 3/4 opposition players out of the game and create space/overloads to attack.

We’ve been so guilty the last few years of slowing the game and allowing the opposition to get 10 men back behind the ball again. Stops being risk vs reward and more risk vs high risk (depending on where the opposition get the ball back).

 

[J_B]

My biggest bug bear. If you want to play out from the back that’s fine, but the whole point is surely to beat that first press and take a minimum of 3/4 opposition players out of the game and create space/overloads to attack.

We’ve been so guilty the last few years of slowing the game and allowing the opposition to get 10 men back behind the ball again. Stops being risk vs reward and more risk vs high risk (depending on where the opposition get the ball back).

Absolutely right.
When you beat the first press you have to make the most of the numerical advantage and get forward. Stopping and turning back and allowing the pressers to get back behind the ball should be a criminal offence.

 

[monmouth]

Absolutely right.
When you beat the first press you have to make the most of the numerical advantage and get forward. Stopping and turning back and allowing the pressers to get back behind the ball should be a criminal offence.

Grimes used to play it back behind the press after we'd beaten the press. It was comical. Leicester showed us how to move the ball yesterday. A lot of that was simply mindset, not player talent. The player talent came in when they got it to the pointy end. Then they would use it and take their risks.

It beggars belief that we take stupid risks where it has no chance of hurting the opponent and none where it does, and that is a 'philosophy'.

 

[JackFish]

Grimes used to play it back behind the press after we'd beaten the press. It was comical.

That was like the Russell Martin special. We'd pass it around at the back, invite the pressure and look like we were about to give the ball away in our own box, then we'd manage to work an intricate passing move together to get the ball out to a winger with a chance to attack but instead of actually taking advantage of the fact that we now had a 4v4 or whatever we'd pass it right back into the hole we'd just come out of.

 

[Ringwood]

For perspective... Coventry struggled against Leicester and didn't score against them and a team scoring 4. 5 and 7 goals at will against everybody else needs to be recognised. AS does need to workout his best X1 balanced side and formation. There is too much reliance on Galbraith at the moment.

On the right hand side debate, I agree that Key needs a break and looking at the Leicester first goal yesterday replicated the same issue we had for Millwall's goal where a shot/cross was allowed to happen with no conviction to cose the space down.

 

[JackSomething]

Grimes used to play it back behind the press after we'd beaten the press. It was comical. Leicester showed us how to move the ball yesterday. A lot of that was simply mindset, not player talent. The player talent came in when they got it to the pointy end. Then they would use it and take their risks.

It beggars belief that we take stupid risks where it has no chance of hurting the opponent and none where it does, and that is a 'philosophy'.

Leicester's tactics when they had a goal kick or free kick in their own box were interesting. They'd have a centre-half take them and play them short. They'd have 6 outfield players and the keeper no further forward than the edge of the 18-yard box along the length of the pitch. The other 4 outfield players would be on the halfway line or in our half. It meant they had enough players to beat our press, then they'd go long if we committed more players. It didn't lead to any big chances, but they came close to breaking through a couple of times and often won second balls in our half using that tactic.

I'm sure other clubs have done similar, but that was the first time I noticed it.

 

[westside]

Lightweight starting with Eom and Cullen.
Don't close down threats.
Too much backwards instead of forwards.
Don't take opportunities to put crosses in or take shots.

 

[FearOfAJackPlanet]

Lightweight starting with Eom and Cullen.
Don't close down threats.
Too much backwards instead of forwards.
Don't take opportunities to put crosses in or take shots.

The last 2 have been evident going back a few managers and drive everyone insane. I think there's a part of it that's not just an 'us' problem, but modern football in general. Crossing and dribbling have gone out of fashion a lot as it's considered too risky and wasteful. Stat-driven methodologies about the best use of the ball and all that. If there's nothing on a platter out wide, recycle the ball back rather than deliver a ball in for your striker(s) to attack.

We're not exactly blessed with creativity in midfield, but we do have, in Vip and Idah, a couple of units that will cause defences problems when balls are delivered, so I wish we'd just...cross...the ball more than we do and back them to do something rather than go into reverse gear. It is better under Sheehan, but we're still too hesitant to just get it in there.