Wrecsam

[Smurph]

Our problem isn’t catchment. Most of the country plays Sunday League football. For some reason Swansea and Carms league seniors play on Saturday afternoon. Our crowds could double overnight if we played Sunday League, but that’s a different conversation. Wrexham is pretty much maxed out geographically.

Swansea senior league isn't half the size it used to be. The local leagues aren't the issue.

Our fanbase is and always has been the size it is now since the move to the dot com.

Apart from the period in the premier league when we attracted the plastics who have since disappeared.

 

[jack_lord]

Swansea senior league isn't half the size it used to be. The local leagues aren't the issue.

Our fanbase is and always has been the size it is now since the move to the dot com.

Apart from the period in the premier league when we attracted the plastics who have since disappeared.

The plastics have certainly disappeared since the product on the field changed. They were back for the last game though

 

[Swanjaxs]

Swansea senior league isn't half the size it used to be. The local leagues aren't the issue.

Our fanbase is and always has been the size it is now since the move to the dot com.

Apart from the period in the premier league when we attracted the plastics who have since disappeared.

The Senior leauge isn't even a third the size it used to be, the Sunday league was only second behind the Liverpool league in size back in the day, now that's gone completely.

 

[Smurph]

The plastics have certainly disappeared since the product on the field changed. They were back for the last game though

The Hull game was more your fair weather fan (which I probably include myself in these days). The premier league plastics hadn't set foot in the dot com prior to us getting promoted or since we ended back up in the championship.

 

[Smurph]

The Senior leauge isn't even a third the size it used to be, the Sunday league was only second behind the Liverpool league in size back in the day, now that's gone completely.

It's a massive shame the way things have worked out in that respect. I miss playing on the weekends, massively.

 

[Swanjaxs]

It's a massive shame the way things have worked out in that respect. I miss playing on the weekends, massively.

Same.

 

[Smurph]

Same.

I was talking to some old fella at the gym on Friday and we were saying the exact same thing. It's being in the changing room and then back to the club house for a few beers watching the results come in.

 

[Derwydd]

Yes, they made 5 million more than us as a League Two clubs, just imagine how much more they will make in the Championship with the 8 million TV money and extra sponsorship. I can see them making easily 40 million, perhaps 50 million isn't inconceivable. However, the jump from League One to Championship is a bigger one than league two to one. I expect a few headline grabbing signings. Vardy has got to be one of them. We could trump that by signing Modric...

Yes they will be sitting there with a budget way bigger than us without the expense that we have.

25m revenue in league 1 will jump to 35m with TV revenue not to mention how much more they can get from sponsorship

 

[JackSomething]

Yes they will be sitting there with a budget way bigger than us without the expense that we have.

25m revenue in league 1 will jump to 35m with TV revenue not to mention how much more they can get from sponsorship

Plus I believe they've paid back loans from the owners, which is part of the reason they've continued to make losses overall. The owners could certainly put money back in (within the rules) in the future for big projects like stadium expansion, but at the moment they don't owe them anything. Compare and contrast with Cardiff...

I'm honestly starting to get a bit jealous of their situation the more I talk about it!

 

[Magic_Michu]

Their sponsorship deals will go through the roof next season.

But, I honestly think they need a whole new starting 11… don’t think they’ve got more than 2 or 3 with enough quality for the championship

 

[Dr. Winston]

Plus I believe they've paid back loans from the owners, which is part of the reason they've continued to make losses overall.

That's the bit that genuinely impresses me.

If they'd only achieved what they have as a result of continued and ongoing subsidy from R&R then that would be much less to shout about. The fact that the initial spending basically "primed the pumps" to the point where vastly increased commercial income has replaced the need for ownership spending is quite business savvy. Not unique (Man City have largely done the same thing) but perhaps unprecedented in the lower leagues.

Keeping that commercial income high will be their big challenge.

 

[JackSomething]

That's the bit that genuinely impresses me.

If they'd only achieved what they have as a result of continued and ongoing subsidy from R&R then that would be much less to shout about. The fact that the initial spending basically "primed the pumps" to the point where vastly increased commercial income has replaced the need for ownership spending is quite business savvy. Not unique (Man City have largely done the same thing) but perhaps unprecedented in the lower leagues.

Keeping that commercial income high will be their big challenge.

Your last line especially is spot on. I think you posted earlier that every season so far has had real drama for the documentary (losing in the playoffs first season, then 3 promotions in a row), so what effect would a couple of seasons of mid-table mediocrity have on the viewing figures? Will their profile (especially in the States) be high enough by then that it doesn't matter?

The comparison to Man City is a good one, although the difference maybe that Wrexham's owners have increased commercial income within the rules!

 

[Dr. Winston]

what effect would a couple of seasons of mid-table mediocrity have on the viewing figures?

Therein lies the question that might give them a few sleepless nights.

They've done well with sponsorships. United Airlines can give them as much cash as they like, but if they were sponsored by say, Aviation Gin, the rules are much stricter.

 

[SwanseaJack]

Therein lies the question that might give them a few sleepless nights.

They've done well with sponsorships. United Airlines can give them as much cash as they like, but if they were sponsored by say, Aviation Gin, the rules are much stricter.

As much I really do not want it to happen, I can really see them being in the Prem within the next 2/3 years because of their financial backing, media exposure and "fairy tale" like story they are tying to create. Also will inevitably help any 50/50 decisions refs have to make subconsciously.

Can't help but think of what Ash was saying a few years back about our biggest issue being getting quality players to relocate to Swansea as it was not near any other major cities etc. They do not have that issue on the other hand and are near a few big cities. If you were stuck between two clubs, and one of them was had all of the above, you would choose them even if they were not fully established yet...

 

[Londonlisa2001]

Plus I believe they've paid back loans from the owners, which is part of the reason they've continued to make losses overall. The owners could certainly put money back in (within the rules) in the future for big projects like stadium expansion, but at the moment they don't owe them anything. Compare and contrast with Cardiff...

I'm honestly starting to get a bit jealous of their situation the more I talk about it!

Not making comment on Wrexham’s finances, but the ‘fact’ going round that Wrexham have only made a loss dues to repayment of owners’ loans cannot be correct as repayment (or receipt) of a loan does not affect profit or loss. It’s a balance sheet and cash flow issue.

In the same way an owner putting in equity also does not affect profit and loss.

Rules are around profit and loss as well as cash flow. Owners can directly affect one (cash flow) but not the other.

Where Wrexham do win out is their ability to attract sponsorship due to their owners. Sponsorship income does affect profit and loss and allows them to spend more and remain within rules.