Musk v Farage

[MajorR]

I give up, what is the point?

It seems that you're more or less agreeing with what I said, then talk about the rape statistics from the white British I really wish I knew what that point was trying to make, I really do.

I was talking about an inquiry into holding people to account for all the failures, since the like 15 years ago? I believe my context is correct, so I’m just confused why you are waffling on about, white males and what the tories didn’t do.

I try to put myself in a realistic situation talking to one of you, face to face, and I have tried but can not envisage anyone coming up with a reply like that, it’s like I say ‘ wow it’s a scandal what’s happened with these grooming gangs’ would the reply be ‘yeah but the white British man, is more responsible for rapes’ IMO No, it would most certainly not be the reply.

In terms of the call for a public enquiry, we’ve had a number of enquiries already and I’m not sure one is needed. The guy who did the ones we’ve already had is well respected and an expert in his field and the enquiry took around 7/8 years to report.

What really annoys me is the double standards we’re seeing from politicians particularly Kemi Badenoch and the Conservatives.

In 2022, the then Minister for Safeguarding Amanda Solloway (Conservative) rejected a request from a Oldham councillor for a public enquiry in to the issue stating "It is for the local authorities in individual towns and cities which are responsible for delivering local services, to commission local inquiries.”
If the Conservatives didn’t feel one was necessary 2 years ago, what’s caused them to change their tune? I’d have a bit more sympathy if Badenoch came out and said her party got it wrong 2 years ago etc etc and people in her party were held to account and sacked, but she hasn’t and all we’re seeing is political football.
Children were raped and she and her party are treating it like a game - it’s disgusting.

The 19th and final report covering Prof Alexis Jay’s 8 year investigation and overarching inquiry into child abuse was published in 2022, but its findings were subsequently ignored by the then Conservative government.
When the report was published in 2022, the then Home Secretary Suella Braverman said "I am delighted that we have accepted the need to act on all but one of the Inquiry’s recommendations, and so demonstrate how seriously the Government takes the Inquiry’s findings. Each of those recommendations covers an extensive programme of work which will deliver real change for the future. I hope you will take the time to read our response to each in detail. But here I want to highlight three key measures which underscore the weight of our commitment to victims and survivors".

We've already had a national abuse inquiry - 7/8 years it took to complete and there were 20 recommendations.
Guess how many of the report’s recommendations the then Government went on to implement ……….0.

Yes thats right a big fat zero. Lots of hot air, but no action, the hypocrisy from politicians is outrageous!! The Conservatives had 2 years to do something but did nothing, they are playing games while the vulnerable remain at risk. If Braverman et al were happy with the recommendations why didn’t they crack on and introduce the changes which would have protected children now and in the future, if they weren’t happy why not say so and do something about it. In truth it appears they (the Conservatives) don’t give a **** about the kids, this is all about making political capital and putting the boot in, when in reality they have more to answer for than Starmer. It’s dog whistling and stirring the pot for mischiefs sake. The previous governments had their chance to sort things out, but they didn’t. Now they bleat to anyone who will listen to them that it’s Labour etc etc…….the truth (in my view) is they have more responsibility to bear than most.

The current government who’ve been in power 6 months are now working on introducing the recommendations that were made over 2 years ago, we should review progress in 6 months.

 

[Londonlisa2001]

What happened with the grooming gangs was absolutely sickening and unforgivable. Each of those animals should have never been let out of prison.

What happened in France with the mass rape of a single woman was absolutely sickening and unforgivable. Each of those animals should never be let out of prison.

The thing is though. One of those sentences leads to ‘there is a massive problem with Pakistani Muslim men’ and the other doesn't lead to ‘there is a massive problem with White Christian men’.

The reality is that there is a massive problem with a significant number of men. Irrespective of ethnicity. Violence against women and girls is widespread. It is even celebrated by a significant minority who glorify absolute scum like Andrew Tate. A person who was found by a court to have been a rapist has been elected as president of the USA. 20% of the parliamentary party of Reform, who’ve been tweeting incessantly about the grooming gangs scandal for the past week, have spent time in prison for violence against women.

I’m pretty convinced that a significant reason why the police turned a blind eye to the grooming gangs was not because of race relations but because the police as a whole don’t give a crap about violence against women and girls. All rapes and sexual assaults are treated as a joke, irrespective of who’s doing it.

And to add insult to injury, one of the few MPs who’s taken this at all seriously is currently under 24 hour protection because of the ill informed tweets from a drugged up grandson of Nazis.

 

[exiledclaseboy]

When you realise that the vast majority of those calling for an enquiry are simply using it as a stick to beat Labour with it all makes sense. They don’t give a fuck about the victims, just the ethnicity of the perpetrators coupled with a hatred of Labour. As others have said, there’s already been an enquiry and the previous (Tory) government didn’t bother doing anything with it. Rancid hypocrisy all round here.

 

[jack123]

What happened with the grooming gangs was absolutely sickening and unforgivable. Each of those animals should have never been let out of prison.

What happened in France with the mass rape of a single woman was absolutely sickening and unforgivable. Each of those animals should never be let out of prison.

The thing is though. One of those sentences leads to ‘there is a massive problem with Pakistani Muslim men’ and the other doesn't lead to ‘there is a massive problem with White Christian men’.

The reality is that there is a massive problem with a significant number of men. Irrespective of ethnicity. Violence against women and girls is widespread. It is even celebrated by a significant minority who glorify absolute scum like Andrew Tate. A person who was found by a court to have been a rapist has been elected as president of the USA. 20% of the parliamentary party of Reform, who’ve been tweeting incessantly about the grooming gangs scandal for the past week, have spent time in prison for violence against women.

I’m pretty convinced that a significant reason why the police turned a blind eye to the grooming gangs was not because of race relations but because the police as a whole don’t give a crap about violence against women and girls. All rapes and sexual assaults are treated as a joke, irrespective of who’s doing it.

And to add insult to injury, one of the few MPs who’s taken this at all seriously is currently under 24 hour protection because of the ill informed tweets from a drugged up grandson of Nazis.

Wow, Just plain whataboutery! Don’t you realise the main argument is why these crimes have not been dealt with earlier, is for fear of conflict to Asian communities?

 

[Swanjaxs]

Here we go...

 

[Londonlisa2001]

Wow, Just plain whataboutery! Don’t you realise the main argument is why these crimes have not been dealt with earlier, is for fear of conflict to Asian communities?

Yes, I do realise what is being said. I’m saying that I believe that the argument not being made is that the police simply don’t take sexual crimes against women seriously whoever does it. The race issue is also a significant factor but all crimes against women and girls are roundly ignored whoever does it.
You don’t seem to understand that a huge number of men involved in this scandal have been ‘dealt with’ as they been sentenced and have served time (not enough time in my opinion) in prison. Perhaps if you read stuff that isn’t moronic right wing crap you’d know that.

 

[jack123]

Yes, I do realise what is being said. I’m saying that I believe that the argument not being made is that the police simply don’t take sexual crimes against women seriously whoever does it. The race issue is also a significant factor but all crimes against women and girls are roundly ignored whoever does it.
You don’t seem to understand that a huge number of men involved in this scandal have been ‘dealt with’ as they been sentenced and have served time (not enough time in my opinion) in prison. Perhaps if you read stuff that isn’t moronic right wing crap you’d know that.

I read lots of stuff. Whatever appears on Twitter or even mainstream media, and my reply to what you have said by there, is wrong.

Shall I tell you why? It’s easy once you read the actual facts of what has happened, it’s totally irrelevant who is reporting it, , the facts are the facts, which you cannot change, the only thing you are doing is by talking about men in general is just muddying the waters, when in fact, this grooming gang scandal should have been dealt with many years ago. What is the point of confusing the issue, when the authorities can’t cope with one issue, let alone adding multiple issues to the mix.

 

[JackSomething]

I read lots of stuff. Whatever appears on Twitter or even mainstream media, and my reply to what you have said by there, is wrong.

Shall I tell you why? It’s easy once you read the actual facts of what has happened, it’s totally irrelevant who is reporting it, , the facts are the facts, which you cannot change, the only thing you are doing is by talking about men in general is just muddying the waters, when in fact, this grooming gang scandal should have been dealt with many years ago. What is the point of confusing the issue, when the authorities can’t cope with one issue, let alone adding multiple issues to the mix.

Why don't you tell us the facts as you see them then? As without that, it just seems like you've been wound up and pointed in a direction by those with an agenda, not for the first time. It seems to me like people have tried to explain the facts to you multiple times in this thread and you choose to ignore what doesn't fit the narrative you've been fed.

 

[Neath_Jack]

Why don't you tell us the facts as you see them then? As without that, it just seems like you've been wound up and pointed in a direction by those with an agenda, not for the first time. It seems to me like people have tried to explain the facts to you multiple times in this thread and you choose to ignore what doesn't fit the narrative you've been fed.

I’d like to ask him which part of the Jay report he found most interesting / concerning (because he’s obviously read that) but I won’t ask in case I upset Rocky bollocks again.

 

[jack123]

Why don't you tell us the facts as you see them then? As without that, it just seems like you've been wound up and pointed in a direction by those with an agenda, not for the first time. It seems to me like people have tried to explain the facts to you multiple times in this thread and you choose to ignore what doesn't fit the narrative you've been fed.

Crumbs, I have already said, numerous times, just some accountability for the scandal that has been ongoing since the first ever so called inquiry, someone said on here it was 2010, so that's 15 years.

I am not wound up at all, just slightly baffled why ANYONE would try to try and mitigate a massive failure on all people that should have protected these kids.

Explain the facts to me? Come on for god sake, what the bloody hell like!

 

[jack123]

I’d like to ask him which part of the Jay report he found most interesting / concerning (because he’s obviously read that) but I won’t ask in case I upset Rocky bollocks again.

Keep up will you, this is not about any investigations previously, (well apart from the failure) This is just someone saying, hang on this stinks, and could we bring attention to all and sundry, that failed these children.

 

[MajorR]

Keep up will you, this is not about any investigations previously, (well apart from the failure) This is just someone saying, hang on this stinks, and could we bring attention to all and sundry, that failed these children.

And we’ve had that with the 7 year enquiry.

They are using this to try and beat Starmer when, in reality he had nothing to do with the initial decision making. He actually changed the rules to make it easier to prosecute offenders.

Nazir Afzal the Chief Prosecutor for the North West of England has gone on record and said Kier Starmer had nothing to to do with the grooming cases, in fact Afzal (who is of Pakistani heritage) himself overturned decisions not to prosecute the offenders and initiate proceedings.

The furore is a made up fuss to discredit Starmer who’s done a lot more to bring offender to justice than most.

 

[jack123]

And we’ve had that with the 7 year enquiry.

They are using this to try and beat Starmer when, in reality he had nothing to do with the initial decision making. He actually changed the rules to make it easier to prosecute offenders.

Nazir Afzal the Chief Prosecutor for the North West of England has gone on record and said Kier Starmer had nothing to to do with the grooming cases, in fact Afzal (who is of Pakistani heritage) himself overturned decisions not to prosecute the offenders and initiate proceedings.

The furore is a made up fuss to discredit Starmer who’s done a lot more to bring offender to justice than most.

Such is the world these days Major, but for for me, and as I have said earlier, this is not about discrediting Starmer, or Labour. This has been around for at least 15 years plus, when obviously Labour weren't in power.

Sorry I should have said, Yes, I realise the connection you were talking about when he was DPP., so with that said, maybe some people are.

 

[MajorR]

Such is the world these days Major, but for for me, and as I have said earlier, this is not about discrediting Starmer, or Labour. This has been around for at least 15 years plus, when obviously Labour weren't in power.

But for most of the people riding on the band wagon it is.

The victims will have had torrid times, lives ruined, self harm etc and a lot of the people commentating and passing comment don’t give 2 hoots about the victims, all they want is the political aspect.

 

[jack123]

But for most of the people riding on the band wagon it is.

The victims will have had torrid times, lives ruined, self harm etc and a lot of the people commentating and passing comment don’t give 2 hoots about the victims, all they want is the political aspect.

Thank you Major, a political point score, this subject should never be.